Biden-Sanders Debate 15 March 2020, Part 2

Part 2 of March Democratic Debate
Dr. Sanjay Gupta: (00:00)
… Gupta and this is CNN.

Dana Bash: (00:06)
Welcome back to the CNN-Univision Democratic Presidential debate, live from Washington DC. And as we noted, Arizona will vote on Tuesday. We solicited questions from undecided Democratic voters there. One is from Amy Langenfeld, who is a law professor from Chandler, Arizona, with a question for Senator Sanders.

Amy Langenfeld: (00:26)
Women are the canaries in the coal mine of the Conservative agenda. Our access to healthcare is at risk- [crosstalk 00:00:31]… from the Federalist Society’s remaking of the courts. Our lives are threatened by abusive partners’ access to guns. Women are disproportionately affected by bail requirements, Social Security cuts and cuts to public education. How will your Cabinet ensure the best advice on issues that affect women’s physical and financial health? Thank you.

Bernie Sanders: (00:55)
My Cabinet, my administration will look like America, last I heard over half of the people in America are women and that will be the representation in my Cabinet and my administration. And in terms of policies, unlike Joe, I have consistently believed and I have a 100% lifetime voting record from groups like NARAL, that it is a women’s right to control her own body, not the government. I have believed that we have got to move aggressively to deal with domestic violence in this country. I have aggressively and I think effectively, made the case that we cannot have women in America earning 80 cents on the dollar compared to men. And if you’re a minority woman, it’s 50 or 60 cents on the dollar.

Bernie Sanders: (01:50)
We need to have universal, affordable, high-quality childcare, so women who are single or married can go off to work and know that their kids are going to be well taken care of. So I think if you look at my agenda, which is on, what you will find, it is a very strong agenda in fighting for the rights of women, who today are under incredible political assault by Trump and Republican governors all across this country.

Dana Bash: (02:20)
Vice President Biden.

Joe Biden: (02:21)
Am I able to respond to that?

Dana Bash: (02:21)

Joe Biden: (02:23)
Yes, thank you. Number one, I agree with the question and the underlying premise of Amy’s question. Number one, I commit it that if I’m elected President and have an opportunity to appoint someone to the courts, I’ll appoint the first black woman to the courts. It’s required that they have representation, now it’s long overdue. Secondly, if I’m elected President, my Cabinet, my administration will look like the country. And I commit that I’ll pick a woman to be Vice President. There are a number of women who are qualified to be President tomorrow, I would pick a woman to be my Vice President.

Joe Biden: (03:03)
Number three, I’m the guy that wrote the domestic violence law and I’m the guy that put in the prohibitions that no one who abuses someone else should be able to own a gun, period. They should not be able to own a gun. I would get the boyfriend exception amended, now I’ve gotten it past that. If you are to get a stay away order from a court, you have a child with someone that you cannot own a gun. No one should be able in a gun who has abused a woman, period.

Dana Bash: (03:30)
Mr. Vice President, if I could just follow up. Just to be clear, you just committed here tonight that your running mate, if you get the nomination will be a woman?

Joe Biden: (03:38)

Dana Bash: (03:40)
Senator Sanders, will you make that same statement?

Bernie Sanders: (03:42)
May I just respond-

Dana Bash: (03:44)

Bernie Sanders: (03:44)
… and ask Joe a question? Right now, a woman’s right to control her own body is under massive assault, unprecedented assault.

Joe Biden: (03:54)
It is.

Bernie Sanders: (03:54)
Joe, you have in the past on more than one occasion, voted for the Hyde Amendment which says that a woman, low-income woman could not use Medicaid funding for an abortion. Is that still your view or have you modified it?

Joe Biden: (04:09)
It is not my view. It is not my view and by the way everybody who’s been in the Congress voted for the Hyde Amendment at one point or another, because it was locked in other bills. The reason why I affirmatively came out opposed to the Hyde Amendment was, that if we’re going to have public funding for all healthcare along the line, there is no way you could allow for there to be a requirement that you have Hyde Amendment, a woman who doesn’t have the money could not have coverage under healthcare.

Bernie Sanders: (04:36)
Well I’m glad.

Joe Biden: (04:36)
Number two… And I did that a while ago, okay. Number one. Number two, I would send immediately to the desk of the United States Congress, when I’m elected President, if I’m elected President, a codification of Roe V Wade amended by Casey because I think it is a woman’s right to choose. I think it’s a woman’s opportunity to be able to make that decision. And in fact, I’ve gotten a 100% rating from NARAL as well.

Dana Bash: (05:01)
Senator Sanders, before we move on, I just want to get you to respond-

Bernie Sanders: (05:04)
Excuse me, you have a lifetime 100% voting record from NARAL?

Joe Biden: (05:07)
I know my record of late from NARAL has been 100%. I don’t know whether it was 25 years ago.

Bernie Sanders: (05:13)
Well all right, I mean, I think one of the differences, not to pick a bone here, is I have been consistent. I’ve always believed in that and you have not. I’m glad you’ve changed your views.

Dana Bash: (05:23)
Senator, just to be clear, the Vice President committed to picking a woman as his running mate. If you get the nomination, will you?

Bernie Sanders: (05:30)
In all likelihood, I will. For me, it’s not just nominating a woman. It is making sure that we have a progressive women and there are progressive women out there, so my very strong tendency is to move in that direction.

Ilia Calderón: (05:47)
Let’s turn now to immigration. Vice President Biden, you recently said for the first time that the Obama-Biden administration made a big mistake in deporting millions of immigrants, but you didn’t publicly speak out against it at the time. What commitment will you make tonight, that as President, you won’t deport millions again?

Joe Biden: (06:11)
Number one, I said that it took much too long to get it right and the President did get it right by DACA as well as making sure that it tried to protect parents as well and by the way, moving on an immigration bill as well. The fact is that we already had a vote on immigration bill, by the way, and Bernie voted against it, the immigration bill. Had he voted forward and had passed, we’d already have 6 million undocumented would be citizens as I speak right now. But I will send to the desk immediately a bill that requires access to citizenship for 11 million undocumented folks, number one. Number two, the first hundred days of my administration, no one, no one will be deported at all. From that point on, the only deportations that will take place are commissions of felonies in the United States of America.

Ilia Calderón: (07:01)
So to be clear, only felons get deported and everyone else gets-

Joe Biden: (07:04)

Ilia Calderón: (07:04)
… to stay?

Joe Biden: (07:06)
Yes, and the reason-

Ilia Calderón: (07:07)
Senator Sanders-

Joe Biden: (07:08)
Is, it’s about uniting families. It’s about making sure that we can both be a nation of immigrants, as well as a nation that is decent.

Bernie Sanders: (07:16)
Let me respond and I’ll answer your question. Let me respond to Joe’s comments about the 2007 immigration bill. That bill was opposed by LULAC, the largest Latino organization in America. The Southern Poverty Law Center called it’s guest-worker programs akin to slavery. There wasn’t really a vote on the bill. It was killed because there was a vote on the Dorgan amendment, I think it was 49-48. And you know who voted with me on that one Joe? Barack Obama. He understood that that proposal was a bad idea. We don’t need slavery in America where workers, guest-workers are forced to say with their employers.

Bernie Sanders: (07:55)
But in terms of immigration in general, let me outline some of the things that we do. Day one, we restore the legal status of 1.8 million young people and their parents in the DACA program. Number two, immediately, we end these ICE raids, which are terrorizing communities all over this country. Three, we changed the border policy, under my administration, no federal agent will ever grab little babies from the arms of their mothers. And fourth, I think we can pass what the American people want and that is comprehensive immigration reform, path towards citizenship for the 11 million undocumented.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta: (08:28)
Senator Sanders, critics suggest, positions like this send a message that when a Democrat is in the White House, the border is open. Do they?

Bernie Sanders: (08:37)
No. That’s just… I mean that’s what Trump says and that is a total lie. What we’re talking about is a humane, sensible policy supported by the American people. Nobody is talking about open borders and of course Trump lies about that. But the bottom line is, right now you have in this country, people who have been here for decades, they are working hard, they’re raising their kids. They are an important part of our agricultural economy, our construction economy. These are good people and yet they are living in terror and we have got to end that terror and end the ICE raids and move toward a path towards citizenship.

Joe Biden: (09:16)
Let me set the record straight on something what was said. You know the idea that it was slavery, Barack Obama supported that immigration bill. Teddy Kennedy supported that immigration bill. I supported it. I doubt whether those people think it’s slavery. And by the way, right after his vote against that, he went on the Lou Dobbs show and continued to canard, that they’re taking jobs. These immigrants are taking jobs from Americans, which is one of the Republican canards, right after that no vote. And so come on, this is… You think Ted Kennedy is for slavery? You think I was for slavery? You think people voted for it for slavery?

Bernie Sanders: (09:54)

Joe Biden: (09:55)
And with regard to your question relative to whether or not I would deal with supporting the border. Look, we can deal with securing the border by national technical means. All the bad things are coming through ports of entry right now, we don’t need a wall. And by the way, I would immediately as President, surge to the border, I would end this notion for the first time in history that people seeking asylum have to be in squalor on the other side of the river, in a desperate situation. They should be able to come to the United States and have a judgment made is whether or not they qualify. I would also surge to the border immigration judges to make decisions immediately and no one, no one would be put in jail while waiting for their hearing.

Ilia Calderón: (10:41)
Senator Sanders?

Bernie Sanders: (10:42)
That’s kind of what I’ve been saying throughout the entire campaign.

Joe Biden: (10:45)
So have I.

Bernie Sanders: (10:46)
So what we need is, at the border, hundreds of administrative judges. We need to deal with people who are seeking asylum, based on international law. We need not to be dividing children from their parents and dividing families up. We need a humane border policy. And I’ll tell you what else we need and I speak as the son of an immigrant. My father came to this country from Poland at the age of 17, without a nickel in his pocket, couldn’t speak English, didn’t have much of an education. I will end, on day one, the demonization, the ugly demonization from the White House of the immigrant community in this country. We’ve got a President who is trying to divide us up. My administration brings our people together, black and white and Latino, Native American, Asian American.

Ilia Calderón: (11:40)
Thank you Senator Sanders. Vice President Biden, you opposed sanctuary cities as a Presidential candidate in 2007, where do you stand now? Should undocumented immigrants arrested by local police be turned over to immigration officials?

Joe Biden: (11:56)

Ilia Calderón: (12:00)
Senator Sanders?

Bernie Sanders: (12:01)
Of course not. Look… And one of the things that goes on when you have that process, is that not only the psychological terror, and I’ve talked to these kids, kids are scared to death in America when they come home from school that their mom or dad may not be there, may be deported. What we need to do is to end, and I will end this on day one, the ICE raids that have been so harmful to so many people. And we need to do, again, what the American people want us to do. I’m the son of an immigrant. This is a country significantly built by immigrant labor, built by slave labor and what we have got to do is appreciate each other and end this demonization and the divisiveness this coming from the Trump administration.

Jake Tapper: (12:52)
Senator Sanders-

Joe Biden: (12:53)
Can I add one thing to that, please?

Jake Tapper: (12:53)
Go ahead.

Joe Biden: (12:54)
Look, we are a nation of immigrants, our future rests upon the Latino community being fully integrated. 24 out of every 100 children in school today from kindergarten through high school is a Latino, right now today. The idea that any American thinks it doesn’t pay for us to significantly invest in their future is absolutely a bizarre notion, because if we do not invest everything that the very wealthy are concerned about and the xenophobes are concerned about, will in fact get worse, not better. We should be embracing, bringing them in, just like what happened with the Irish immigrants after the famine, just what happened with the Italians, et cetera. We’ve been through this before, xenophobia is a disease.

Jake Tapper: (13:37)
Thank you Vice President Biden. Let’s move now to the climate crisis. I’m coming right to you Senator Sanders. The world Health Organization calls the climate crisis, a “Health crisis” and warns that climate change could fuel the spread of infectious diseases. Can you point to specific measures in your climate plan that address that threat?

Bernie Sanders: (13:57)
Well, of course we do. I mean we… Look, this is what the scientists are telling us, the same scientists who make your point there, Jake. What they’re telling us is, if we don’t get our act together in the next seven or eight years, there would be irreversible damage done to this planet. We’re talking about cities in America, from Miami to New Orleans to Charleston, South Carolina being underwater. We are talking about severe droughts which will prevent farmers in the Midwest from growing the food that we need. We’re talking about extreme weather disturbances which hit Houston Texas, Venice Italy, just a few months ago.

Bernie Sanders: (14:37)
We are talking about the absolute need and I want to hear Joe’s position on this. This is not a middle of the ground thing. This is not building a few more solar panels or a few more wind turbines. What this is about is transforming our energy system, as quickly as we humanly can, away from fossil fuel. It is insane that we continue to have fracking in America. It is absurd that we give tens of billions of dollars a year in tax breaks and subsidies to the fossil fuel industry. This has got the end and end now if we love our kids and future generations.

Jake Tapper: (15:15)
Vice President Biden?

Joe Biden: (15:16)
First thing that President Obama and I were summoned to the State Department… Excuse me, the Defense Department for was to meet with all the chiefs, the single greatest threat to our national security, they said, is climate change. Single greatest threat to our national security, because as populations have to move because they can no longer live where they are, because their islands are sinking, because you saw what happened in Darfur, with the change in weather patterns and the deserted there. It causes war, it causes great migrations, great migrations. They said that’s the single biggest problem. Number two, there’s an awful lot of people today who are in fact getting ill because of the changes in the environment, particularly up where Bernie lives. I’m not… It has nothing to do with him. But having, up in the Northeast, because you have everything from beetle infestation and a whole range of things that are causing diseases as well, in addition to eliminating foliage. But-

Jake Tapper: (16:11)
So Vice President Biden, let me ask you then, you talk about this being the number one crisis-

Joe Biden: (16:16)

Jake Tapper: (16:17)
… they told you at the Pentagon. The price tag for your climate plan is about $1.7 trillion. That’s about $14 trillion less than Senator Sanders wants to spend on this. Is your plan ambitious enough to tackle this crisis?

Joe Biden: (16:30)
Yes, it is ambitious enough to tackle the crisis, because what… Go to, I lay out the first 13 things I would do immediately upon being elected. Number one, we’re going to once again reinstate all the cuts the President made and everything from the cafe standards, how far automobiles can go, investing in light rail so that we take cars off the road, making sure we’re in a position where we are now in a position that we put 500,000 charging stations in areas that… [silence 00:17:03] … all new highways that we built, making sure that we spent $500 billion a year… [silence 00:17:22] and the federal government paying for transportation, the vehicles we run, all of those being converted to being able to run on low carbon fuel and/or be able to run on no carbon fuel at all by having them move into a direction that is all carbon free. We can do these things. We can lay down the tracks where nothing can be changed by the next President or the following President, the one beyond that.

Joe Biden: (18:02)
In addition to that, we also have to… I would immediately rejoin the Paris climate accord, which I helped put together. I would call the 100 nations, over a hundred nations, but the hundred major polluters to the United States and the first hundred days, to up the ante and make it clear that in fact if they didn’t, there’d be a price to pay. And lastly, I would be right now organizing the hemisphere and the world, to provide $20 billion for the Amazon, for Brazil no longer to burn the Amazon, so they could have forests… They’re no longer forests but they could have farming and say, “This is what we’re going to do.” … the region is burning out than we admit in one entire year, per year.

Jake Tapper: (18:41)
Thank you, Mr. Vice President. Senator Sanders?

Bernie Sanders: (18:43)
All well and good, but nowhere near enough. I mean, you mentioned, we started this debate talking about a warlike situation in terms of the coronavirus and we said, “We have to act accordingly.” You said it. I think you’re right. I said it. We have to act dramatically, boldly, if we’re going to save lives in this country and around the world. I look at climate change in exactly the same way. It’s not a question of reentering the Paris Accord. That’s fine. Who cares? It’s not a big deal. The deal right now is, do we have the courage? And this gets back to the point I’m trying to make all night long. Do we take on the healthcare industry and tell them their profits are not more important than healthcare for all? Do we take on the fossil fuel industry?

Bernie Sanders: (19:28)
Look, in terms of the fossil fuel industry, these guys have been lying, they’ve been lying for years, like the tobacco industry lied 50 years ago. “Oh we don’t know if fossil fuels, if oil and carbon emissions are causing climate change.” They knew. ExxonMobil knew, they lied. In fact, I think they should be held criminally accountable. But this Jake, is an issue of enormous consequence. What Joe was saying goes nowhere near enough. It’s not a question of money. Give me a minute here. We have time to talk about this. This is a world shaking event.

Jake Tapper: (20:03)
I understand. I just want to give him a chance to respond and then we can come back to you.

Bernie Sanders: (20:05)
Okay, fine let’s stay on.

Jake Tapper: (20:06)
We’re staying on this issue.

Joe Biden: (20:07)
Number one, no more subsidies for fossil fuel industry. No more drilling on federal lands. No more drilling, including offshore. No ability for the oil industry to continue to drill, period, ends, number one. Number two, we’re in a situation as well where we cannot… We are able to move rapidly to change the dynamic, in terms of what we can do to set in motion. The fact that he says climate change, Paris Accord doesn’t mean much. We could get everything exactly right, we’re 15% of the problem. 85% of the problem is over there. We need someone who can deal internationally. We need someone who can bring the together again. We need someone who can move in a direction that in fact, if you violate the commitment you make, you will pay an economic price for it. Like what’s happening in China there they’re exporting coal, significant coal.

Jake Tapper: (21:00)
Thank you.

Bernie Sanders: (21:01)
Okay. Look, obviously the Paris Accord is useful, but it doesn’t go anywhere… If you’re laughing Joe, then you’re missing the point.

Joe Biden: (21:08)
You’re missing the point.

Bernie Sanders: (21:08)
This is an existential crisis.

Joe Biden: (21:10)

Bernie Sanders: (21:11)
You talk about… I’m talking about stopping fracking, as soon as we possibly can. I’m talking about telling the fossil fuel industry that they are going to stop destroying this planet. No ifs, buts and maybes about it. I’m talking about speaking-

Joe Biden: (21:27)
So am I.

Bernie Sanders: (21:28)
… to China… Well, I’m not sure your proposal does that. I’m talking about speaking to China, to Russia, to countries all over the world and in this moment, making the point that instead of spending 1.8 trillion on weapons of destruction designed to kill each other, maybe we should pool our resources and fight our common enemy, which is climate change. I know your heart is in the right place, but this requires dramatic, bold action. We’ve got to take on the fossil fuel industry. Your plan does not do that.

Joe Biden: (21:59)
My plan takes on the fossil fuel industry and it unites the world. He just got finished saying, what’s he going to do? He’s going to bring these countries together, making it clear to them. I’m saying we bring them together, make them live up to the commitments. If they don’t live up to the commitments, they pay a financial price for it. They pay an economic price for it. Because we can do everything, my state is three feet above sea level. I don’t need a lecture on what’s going to happen about rising seas. I know what happens. I watched the whole Delmarva Peninsula, just like it is in South Carolina and the rest. Something I know a little bit about, I wrote the first climate change bill that was in the Congress, which PolitiFact said was a game changer. I’m the guy who came along and said with Dick Lugar, that we’re going to trade, we’ll forgive your debt if you don’t cut down your FARs. I’ve been way ahead of this curve. This idea that all of a sudden Bernie found this out is amazing to me.

Jake Tapper: (22:53)
Senator Sanders?

Bernie Sanders: (22:53)
No, Bernie didn’t find it out. Bernie is listening to the scientists and what… You’re talking about making countries around the world fulfill their commitments. Those commitments are not enough. What this moment is about Joe, is that the scientists are telling us they underestimated the severity of the crisis. They were wrong. The problem is more severe. So all that I’m saying right here is that we are fighting for the future of this planet, for the wellbeing of our kids and future generations. You cannot continue, as I understand Joe believes, to continue fracking, correct me if I’m wrong. What we need to do right now is bringing the world together, tell the fossil fuel industry that we are going to move aggressively to win solar, sustainable energies-

Jake Tapper: (23:43)
Thank you.

Bernie Sanders: (23:44)
… and energy efficiency.

Jake Tapper: (23:45)
Thank you Senator.

Joe Biden: (23:46)
No more, no new fracking. And by the way, on the Recovery Act, I was able to make sure we invested $90 billion in making sure we brought down the price of solar and wind, that is lower than the price of coal. That’s why not another new coal plant will be built. I did that while you were watching, number one. Number two, we’re in a situation where we in fact have the ability to lay down the tracks where no one can change the dynamic. And that’s why we should be talking about things like I’ve been talking about for years, high speed rail, taking millions of automobiles off the road. Making sure that we move in a direction where no more, no more drilling on federal lands, making sure that we invest in changing the entire fleet-

Jake Tapper: (24:32)
Thank you.

Joe Biden: (24:32)
… of the United States military to… I know.

Jake Tapper: (24:35)
Thank you, Mr. Vice President. Senator Sanders-

Bernie Sanders: (24:36)
Can I respond?

Jake Tapper: (24:37)
… I want to talk to you about fracking because you want to ban fracking-

Bernie Sanders: (24:40)

Jake Tapper: (24:40)
… which is a method of extracting natural gas. The shift towards natural gas and away from coal has resulted in reduced US carbon emissions. So how can the US transition to your targeted goal is zero emissions with fracking completely out of the picture?

Bernie Sanders: (24:56)
Because we have to invest in an unprecedented way, in an unprecedented way. You started off by saying that we’re talking about a 13, $14 trillion investment. That is a lot of money and I’ve been criticized for that. But I don’t know what the alternative is, if we are playing for the future of this planet. So we’ve got to be dramatic and what being dramatic is, massive investments in wind, in solar and sustainable energies in general and research and development, in making our buildings all over this country… In my state of Vermont and around this country, got a lot of old buildings. We can put millions…

Part 3 of March Democratic Debate
Jake Tapper: (00:04)
Welcome back to the CNN Univision Democratic presidential debate on Tuesday. Voters in Arizona, Ohio, Illinois, and Florida will cast their votes in the democratic primary. Here’s Univision’s Ilia Calderón.

Ilia Calderón: (00:15)
Thank you, Jake. Let’s move now to foreign policy. Senator Sanders, there are about 1.5 million Cuban Americans living in Florida right now. Why would they vote for you when they hear you praise a program of Fidel Castro, a dictator who jailed, tortured, and killed thousands of Cubans.

Bernie Sanders: (00:36)
I have opposed or authoritarianism, whether it’s in Cuba, whether it’s in Saudi Arabia, whether it’s in China or whether it is in Russia. That is my life record. I believe unlike the president of the United States, in democracy, not authoritarianism in Cuba or any place else.

Bernie Sanders: (00:57)
What I believe right now in this world is that we are faced with a global crisis and a movement toward authoritarianism. That’s what Putin in Russia is leading, that’s what MBS in Saudi Arabia is leading. And as president of the United States, unlike Donald Trump, I will put the flag down and say that in this country and in this world, we have got a move toward democracy and human rights. That is my view and has always been my view.

Ilia Calderón: (01:27)
To be clear, Senator Sanders, Cuba has been a dictatorship for decades. Shouldn’t we judge dictators by the violation of human rights and not by any of their alleged achievements?

Bernie Sanders: (01:39)
Well, I think you can make the same point about China. China is undoubtedly an authoritarian society. Okay? But would anybody deny, any economists deny that extreme poverty in China today is much less than what it was 40 or 50 years ago? That’s a fact. So I think we condemn authoritarianism, whether it’s in China, Russia, Cuba, any place else. But to simply say that nothing ever done by any of those administrations had a positive impact on their people, would I think be incorrect.

Ilia Calderón: (02:14)
Vice president Biden, you have criticized Senator Sanders for bracing Castro’s education system, but in 2016 president Obama said Cuba made “A great progress in educating young people and that its healthcare system is a huge achievement that they should be congratulated for” How is that different from what Senator Sanders has said?

Joe Biden: (02:36)
He was trying to change Cuban policies so the Cuban people would get out from under the thumb of the Castro and his brother. That is to change the policy so that we can impact on Cuba’s policy by getting them opened up. That was about, but the praising of the Sandinistas, the praising of Cuba, the praising just now of China. China is an authoritarian dictatorship. That’s what it is. We have to deal with them because they’re there.

Joe Biden: (03:03)
But the idea that they in fact have increased the wealth of people in that country, it’s been marginal that change that’s taken place. It is still, they have a million Uyghurs, a million Muslims in prison camps in the West. You see what’s happening in Hong Kong today. And by the way, the idea that he praised the Soviet Union when it was the Soviet Union about the things that they had done well, they are an awful dictatorship killing millions and millions of people.

Joe Biden: (03:28)
And in addition to that, we have a circumstance where after the election was all over and we knew what was done by the Russians now and interfering with our elections, this man voted against sanctioning Russia for interference in our elections.

Ilia Calderón: (03:44)
Senator Sanders.

Joe Biden: (03:45)
I don’t get it.

Bernie Sanders: (03:46)
Well, what you don’t get in. This is exactly what the problem with politics is about. All right. Question. Did China make progress in ending extreme poverty over the last 50 years? That’s a no.

Joe Biden: (03:58)
That’s like saying Jack the ripper.

Bernie Sanders: (04:00)
No, it’s not Joe.

Joe Biden: (04:01)
Yes, it is.

Bernie Sanders: (04:01)
You see, Joe, this is the problem.

Joe Biden: (04:02)
Yes, it is.

Bernie Sanders: (04:03)
This is the problem. We can’t talk … I know there’s a political line, I understand. China’s terrible, awful, nothing ever good [inaudible 00:04:10] but the fact of the matter is China, of course is an authoritarian state. It’s what I just said.

Joe Biden: (04:15)
It’s a dictatorship.

Bernie Sanders: (04:17)
That’s what I just said five minutes ago. And by the way, the question that was asked quoted Barack Obama, president Obama was more generous in his praise of what Cuba did in healthcare and education than I was. I was talking about a program 60 years ago in the first year of the Castro revolution.

Bernie Sanders: (04:37)
So the bottom line is, that I think it’s a little bit absurd if we’re going to look at the world the way it is. Of course, we are opposed to authoritarian. And by the way, before it was considered good policy, good idea. I was condemning the dictatorship in Saudi Arabia when a lot of other people in Washington-

Joe Biden: (04:57)
With me.

Bernie Sanders: (04:59)
I was condemning the dictatorship in the UAE, you were not.

Bernie Sanders: (05:02)
Yes, I was.

Ilia Calderón: (05:03)
Thank you, Senator Sanders, Vice president Biden.

Joe Biden: (05:05)
Look, the idea of occasionally saying something nice about a country is one thing. The idea of praising a country that is violating human rights around the world is in fact makes our allies wonder what’s going on. What do you think the South Koreans think when he praises China like that? What do you think the Australians believe in the shadow of China? What do you think is happening in Indonesia in the shadow of China? What do you think is happening in terms of Japan in the shadow of China? Words matter. These are flat out dictators, period, and they should be called for it. Straight up. We may have to work out.

Joe Biden: (05:45)
For example, I was able to help negotiate a new start agreement with Russia, not because I like Putin, the guy is a thug.

Jake Tapper: (05:52)
Mr. Vice president, sticking with foreign policy, you acknowledge that your support and vote for the Iraq war was a mistake. What lessons did you learn from that mistake, and how might those lessons influence your foreign policy decision making as president?

Joe Biden: (06:09)
I learned I can’t take the word of a president when in fact they assured me that they would not use force. Remember the context, the context was the United Nations Security Council was going to vote to insist that we allow inspectors into determine whether or not they were in fact producing nuclear weapons or weapons of mass destruction. They were not.

Joe Biden: (06:30)
And what’s the first thing that happened when we got elected? The president Obama turned to me and said, get those troops out of the hours responsible for getting 150,000 combat troops out of Iraq. I admitted 14 years ago was in [spect 00:06:43] to have trusted him and I’m prepared to compare my foreign policy credentials up against my friend here on any day of the week and every day of the week.

Bernie Sanders: (06:52)
Okay, let’s start off with the war in Iraq, Joe, I was there too. I was in the house. I understood … and by the way, let’s be clear about what that vote was and you were there at the signing ceremony with Bush. Everybody in the world knew that when you voted for that resolution, you were giving Bush the authority to go to war and everybody knew that’s exactly what he and Cheney wanted to do.

Bernie Sanders: (07:18)
Most people who followed that issue closely understood that the Bush administration was lying through its teeth with regard to Saddam having weapons of mass destruction. I understood that, I was on the floor of the house time and time again. But the issue is not just the war in Iraq. That was a long time ago. The issue is the trade agreement. What is it so easy for me to lead the effort against disastrous trade agreements?

Bernie Sanders: (07:43)
The issue was the bankruptcy bill that you supported. The issue was the Hyde amendment. The issue is the defense of marriage Act. The issue is whether or not in difficult times and God knows these are difficult times. We’re going to have the courage to take on powerful special interest and do what’s right for the working families of this country.

Jake Tapper: (08:06)
Vice president Biden.

Joe Biden: (08:07)
Why did you vote not to sanction the Russians?

Bernie Sanders: (08:10)
You know why? Because I had every … you keep talking about Iran that was tied to Iran. Russia was in Iran. I think John Kerry indicated his support for what I did. That was undermining the Iranian agreement. That’s why.

Joe Biden: (08:24)
That’s not true. Our [crosstalk 00:08:24]

Bernie Sanders: (08:24)
That’s why, and that’s the only reason why I have condemned Russia time and time again.

Jake Tapper: (08:27)
Vice president Biden.

Joe Biden: (08:28)
The fact is that the idea that I in fact supported the things that you suggested is not accurate. Look, I’m the guy that helped put together the Iran deal and got the inspectors in there. My chief of staff was the guy, my foreign policy guy doing that negotiation, I was the guy that helped put together a 60-nation organization to take on the ISIS in Iraq and in Syria. I’ve dealt with these folks, I know them, and I know what they’re like and I know who the good guys are and who the bad guys are.

Joe Biden: (09:02)
The fact is, this Bernie’s notion about how he embraces folks like the Sandinistas and Cuba and the former Soviet Union and talks about the good things they did in China is absolutely contrary to every message we want to send the rest of the world.

Jake Tapper: (09:18)
Senator Sanders.

Bernie Sanders: (09:21)
I have led the effort against all forms of authoritarianism, including America’s so-called allies in the UAE and in Saudi Arabia. And in fact, as you may know, worked with conservative Republicans to utilize for the very first time the War Powers Act to get the United States out of the horrific war in Yemen led by Saudi Arabia. That’s what I did. So my view is that in a world moving toward authoritarianism, the United States has got to be the leader where people all over the world look to us for guidance.

Ilia Calderón: (10:00)
Thank you, Senator. Thank you gentlemen. I want to change topics and ask each of you about some of your vulnerabilities in this election. Starting with you, Vice president Biden, Senator Sanders has one more of the Hispanic vote than you in several key States so far. In fact, he doubled your support in California among Hispanics. He almost tripled it in Nevada. So why is your message not resonating with Hispanic voters?

Joe Biden: (10:24)
Well, look, my message has resonated across the board. Every single state we’ve been in, there’s been a significant turnout. In Virginia, turnout was up 70%, they voted for me. He didn’t bring them out, I brought them out. And number two, look what’s happened in Mississippi. Look what’s happened in North Carolina, look what’s happened in Washington state. Look what’s happening across the board. Why is it that I’m winning all those places? What’s the reason? What’s the reason? The reason is because they know I am a Democrat with a capital D who in fact believes that our base is the base of the Democratic party, which are hardworking men and women who are in fact are high school educated, African Americans and minorities, including Hispanics, but all minorities. Suburban women, people who in fact have a sense of our place in the world. That’s why I am winning, not just winning, but overwhelmingly winning, not even close in these places. And-

Bernie Sanders: (11:19)
Well, you didn’t quite win-

Ilia Calderón: (11:20)
Senator Sanders, let me just follow up with you about an issue that you’re having for the second consecutive presidential election. You’re struggling to gain wide support from African-Americans. Why is your message not resonating with African-American voters?

Bernie Sanders: (11:37)
Here is what I believe is happening and this is an important point and why I decided to run for president. I think it’s imperative that we defeat Trump. I think our campaign of a biracial, bigenerational, multigenerational grassroots movement is the way to do it. Now we have won some states, Joe has won more States than I have, but here’s what we are winning. We are winning the ideological struggle. Even in States like Mississippi where Joe won a major victory. It turns out that a pretty good majority of the folks there believe in Medicare for … and that’s true in almost every state in this country.

Bernie Sanders: (12:15)
And the other issue that we don’t talk enough about is we are winning the generational struggle. Depending on the state, we’re winning people 50 years of age or younger, big time people, 30 years of age and younger. I frankly have my doubts.

Bernie Sanders: (12:29)
Look, if I lose this thing, Joe wins, Joe, I will be there for you. But I have my doubts about how you win a general election against Trump will be a very, very tough opponent unless you have energy, excitement, the largest voter turnout in history. And to do that you are going to have to bring young people who are not great voters. They don’t vote in the kinds of numbers they should into the political process. You’re going to have to bring Latinos who are great people, have the agenda that we need, but also don’t vote in the numbers that we need. I have my doubts that vice president Biden’s campaign can generate that energy and excitement and that voter turnout.

Joe Biden: (13:09)
I will do that. And by the way, just get this straight. The energy and excitement is taking place so far has been for me. 70% turnout increased in Virginia, I can go down the list, they’re coming out for me and I didn’t even have the money to compete with this man in those States. I virtually had no money. The press kept saying Biden has no money and they were right by net, no money. And the idea, why are they doing that? The reason they’re doing that is because they understand I know what has to happen, that I know what needs to be done.

Joe Biden: (13:41)
And by the way, the idea that everybody supports Medicare for all he has still hadn’t indicated how much it’s going to cost people. He’s yet to know exactly what’s going to … So here’s my point. People don’t know the detail at all and the fact is I am winning-

Ilia Calderón: (13:57)
Thank you, sir.

Joe Biden: (13:57)
… overwhelmingly among democratic constituencies across the board.

Ilia Calderón: (14:01)
Thank you Mr. Vice president. We are going to be right back with more from the CNN Univision Democratic presidential debates. Stay right there.

Closing Statements
Jake Tapper: (00:00)
Welcome back to the CNN Univision Democratic Presidential Debate. Finally, gentlemen, thanks so much for everything. As we end here tonight, let’s return to where we began, the coronavirus, which does not discriminate based on ideology. It does not care if one is a Democrat or Republican, a Conservative, a Moderate or a Progressive. Senator Sanders, let me start with you. What’s your closing message tonight for those who are concerned about, effected by, or dealing with the coronavirus?

Bernie Sanders: (00:29)
Well, our hearts go out to everyone. We need to move aggressively, to make sure that every person in this country who has the virus, who thinks they have the virus, understands they get all the healthcare that they need, because they are Americans, that we move aggressively to make sure that the test kits are out there, that the ventilators are out there, that the ICU units are out there, that the medical personnel are out there.

Bernie Sanders: (00:59)
But Jake, if I might also say, that in this moment of economic uncertainty, in addition to the coronavirus, it is time to ask how we get to where we are, not only our lack of preparation for the virus, but how we end up with an economy, with so many about people are hurting at a time of massive income and wealth inequality. It is time to ask the question of where the power is in America. Who owns the media? Who owns the economy? Who owns the legislative process? Why do we give tax breaks to billionaires and not raise the minimum wage?

Bernie Sanders: (01:41)
Why do we pump up the oil industry while a half a million people are homeless in America? This is the time to move aggressively, dealing with the coronavirus crisis, to deal with the economic fallout, but it’s also a time to rethink America, and create a country where we care about each other, rather than a nation of greed and corruption, which is what is taking place among the corporate elite.

Jake Tapper: (02:07)
Thank you, senator Sanders. Vice President Biden, what’s your closing message tonight for those concerned about affected by or dealing with with this virus?

Joe Biden: (02:16)
Number one, as I said at the outset, I just can’t imagine what people are going through right now who have lost someone already. I can’t imagine what people are going through when they have a mom. Like for example, a good friend of ours is sitting outside the window of a nursing home where her mom is because she can’t go in, trying to do sign language to her mom and through the window to be able to talk to her. I guess I can imagine the fear and concern people have. Number one, one of the things that I think we have to understand is that this is an all hands on deck. This is, as someone said, maybe it was you Jake at the outset, this is bigger than any individual. This is bigger than yourself. This is about America. This is about the world. This is about how we bring people together and make the kind of sacrifices we need to make to get this done, and so first and foremost, where we have to do is start to listen to the science again.

Joe Biden: (03:16)
As I said, what we did, we met and that what I’d be doing today, I’d be sitting down in the situation room literally every day like we did at the outset of other crises we had when we were in the White House, and pulling together the best people and not just the United States the world and say, “What is it? What are the prescriptive moves we have to take now to lessen this virus to beat it, to go to the point where we can save more lives, get more people tested, get more people to kind of care they need?”

Joe Biden: (03:45)
And then what do we do beyond that to make sure that the economic impact on them is in fact rendered harmless? That we in fact make sure every paycheck is met, every paycheck that’s out there that the people are going to miss, that we keep people in their homes, they don’t miss their mortgage payments, they don’t miss their rent payments, making sure that they’re going to be able to take care of education, and by the way, the education systems are closing down right now, and so there’s so many things we have to do.

Joe Biden: (04:15)
In addition to that, we have to do is we have to have the best science in the world and telling us what can stay open and what need be closed. Like I said earlier, the idea that we are closing schools, which I understand, but not being able to provide lunches for people who in fact need the school lunch program to get by. The idea that we would close any place that I can understand the decision made to close places where a hundred or 50 people or more gather, but how do you keep open the drug store to make sure you can get your prescription? How do you deal with the things that necessarily have to be kept going and what’s the way to do that? There should be a national standard for that. It should be coming out of the situation room right now.

Joe Biden: (04:57)
And by the way, the single most significant thing we can do should deal with the larger problem down the road of income inequality is get rid of Donald Trump, Donald Trump. He’s exacerbated every single one of these problems, both the immediate urgent need, and how we’re going to hold people harmless for the damage done as a consequence of this virus. It’s important we do both.

Jake Tapper: (05:22)
Vice President Biden, Senator Sanders, I would want to thank you both for being here tonight under these challenging and trying circumstances. We wish both of you the best. Our thanks as well to our partners at Univision. For Ilia Calderon and Dana Bash, I’m Jake Tapper. Thank you so much for watching. Please stay healthy. Stay safe. Our coverage of both tonight’s debate and the coronavirus pandemic continues now with Anderson Cooper.

Anderson Cooper: (05:48)
Jake, thanks very much. There you have the CNN Univision Democratic Debate, Joe Biden, Bernie Sanders, and a third unwelcome player, the coronavirus. The candidates acknowledged it at the closed debate in their final remarks.